From Brand New Practice to Tens of Thousands in Monthly Revenue in Six Months

July 15th, 2016

I am really excited for today’s episode because today we’re interviewing Ardy Pirnia, whose one of our provider attorneys in LA County. To put it bluntly, Ardy is killing it. I mean it’s been amazing to watch the growth that he has brought to his firm in literally just a handful of months. I mean I think six months in from when we got started sending him leads and he’s been taking off like a rocket ship bringing on three paralegals, three staff. Going from a solo practitioner to now three paralegals, three employees, and literally tens of thousands of dollars revenue largely due to the volume of leads that we’ve been sending him in LA County and some of the surrounding areas.

It’s just been really exciting to watch. He has a very unique approach to the way he works with clients, very flexible. Doesn’t offer retainer fees in the traditional sense. Offers primarily flat rates and he really gets into exactly how he does it. Firmly believes the importance of learning how to sell yourself as an attorney and how to convey your unique value to your clients. He gets into the numbers. He gets on the return on investment. He has a very unique and long-term view of what internet leads can mean to a practice and he is living proof of the kind of revenues that you can see when you can really optimize your systems to fielding leads and converting them effectively.

Let’s get right into it, this interview with Ardy Pirnia, one of our provider attorneys in Los Angeles County.

Below is the transcription of this episode from our Unbundled Attorney Mastermind Podcast. You can listen to the entire episode by clicking here.

Dave Aarons: Ardy, welcome to the show.

Ardy Pirnia: Thank you, Dave. I really appreciate it.

Dave Aarons: I guess we’ve been working together for our six months. What is the coverage area that you’ve been handling? It’s just LA County, right? I mean just LA County I think is the biggest county in the US I think, right?

Ardy Pirnia: It is. It’s a large one. It feels like I’m handling three counties, but yeah, it’s LA County.

Dave Aarons: LA County. You do family law leads and immigration. Immigration’s a little bit broader. Do you do San Bernardino Riverside or what’s the region that’s you’ve been fielding?

Ardy Pirnia: Immigration we really can span the whole state I mean because it’s federal law. We just recently retained someone is Lake Arrowhead even.

Dave Aarons: Cool. Maybe where we could start with is just you can maybe give just a little bit of a background on kind of how you got started, how long you’ve been working in the field, maybe something unique about your practice and why family law and immigration and maybe just give everyone a little bit of background on kind of how you got up and running as an attorney?

Ardy Pirnia: Sure. I graduated from Pepperdine Law School in 2012 and I’ve been working ever since. I first worked for two big firms for two years actually doing different kinds of torts, mass asbestos, personal injury, car accident, things like that. I found that I wanted to start practicing in areas that I guess gave me more value in terms of feeling like I’m actually doing something really good for the clients and feeling good about myself at the end of the day. That’s why I got linked up with Unbundled Attorney. I guess it’s our six month anniversary. I started with the family law leads. At $45 a lead, I found that they really, really began paying off when you stick to it. When immigration came around, I wanted to add another practice field to my firm.

I added that as well. To be honest, I started my firm on my own two years after being out of law school with just personal injury and just referrals through word of mouth. Ever since I added the family law and immigration, now I have a pretty legit boutique firm with three paralegals, three other employees, and three practice areas that are doing really well.

Dave Aarons: Awesome. Awesome. It’s a pretty large coverage area. Roughly how many leads do you typically receive on maybe a weekly basis and maybe you can share a little bit about kind of how things have been going for you from an overall conversion rate or something like that so people get some context on how you’ve been doing so far?

Ardy Pirnia: Yeah. I mean I’ll tell you, for example, I just got my invoice for the last two weeks. I had a 56 lead between family law and immigration.

Dave Aarons: Wow.

Ardy Pirnia: At $45 a lead for family law and $65 for immigration, you can imagine 50 leads. It wasn’t a cheap bill either, but the thing is that the value proposition is really high in this case because the leads are so reasonably priced. The way that I think about it is I’m spending … That invoice was about $2,500 for two weeks. What did I do in these last two weeks through Unbundled? Well, I had one client sign up for what’s began as just a one-time appearance for him in a family law modification. I charged him $600 for that just out the door for half the day to come and represent him. What happened is the case got continued. They had a few other things they wanted to do. He ended up giving me another $1,000 down and $1,000 at the hearing for the last few weeks work.

Basically, I paid for those 56 leads through that one client who I met for a one-time unbundled appearance, and it led to something that I’ll probably be representing him for the next year. As much as sometimes you get scared to get hit with an invoice of $2,000 or $3,000 or $1,500, as long as you keep on trucking, it pays for itself and multiplies by multiple multiples. I mean in the beginning, the first 20 leads I got for family law, it was scary. I only signed one up. I had spent almost $1,000 and I had only made $1,000. I said, “Well, is this really worth it,” but then I signed up the next five in a row at $1,500 to $2,500 and at that point, I had made almost 10 times my money.

Dave Aarons: Right.

Ardy Pirnia: The numbers are definitely there. It’s just the type of thing that you have to give it … For the younger attorneys and the ones just starting out, you have to give it time. You can’t take a small sample size of 10 or 20 leads and give up on it. You’ve got to hit 50 or 100 and you’ll really see the value come back as long as you know what you’re doing and you have a good system.

Dave Aarons: Do you know roughly what your conversion rate is for family law and immigration kind of just generally speaking? I mean I know it takes some time sometimes for some clients to come in, but overall is 1 of 10, one out of five? Do you know?

Ardy Pirnia: If you take out the lead that they’re not actually family law, or they made a mistake in what they’re asking for and all that, it’s about one to three for family law and one to four for immigration.

Dave Aarons: Wow. That’s really awesome, Ardy. That’s really great. Those are some really good numbers. If you can structure them out, I don’t know what the average client value is, but it’s probably somewhere in the $2,000 range, something like that.

Ardy Pirnia: You know Dave, I think what a lot of young lawyers do is they’re just looking at balancing the sheet in that month and they’re not looking at the big picture. For me, I knew that these clients are not only going to pay $1,500 or $2,000 for their small immigration adjustment of status or a modification in a family law case, but they’re going to be a lifelong client when they see that we went out of our way to help them in their time of need where they had nowhere to turn, where they went to other attorneys and they’re asking for 5, 10 grand. You really build a bond and a relationship with these people. If you take time to nurture and foster that, they become your friend. I send them text every now and then. They’ll send me text, “Hey, I’m in a band. Come to my show.”

It turned out that my first client ever actually for family law. We kept in touch. I do personal injury and that’s the forte really of my firm. He referred me a very, very big personal injury case a few weeks ago. The money that we’ll make probably from that personal injury case in the future will probably pay for the family law leads for the entire calendar year. It’s just building your client base, building the clientele. Even the leads you don’t sign up, those are valuable because if you leave a good impression on them and on them, they’ll store your number and they’ll call you in the future.

Dave Aarons: Right. Yup. Yeah. As you mentioned, as you start taking more leads, you really start kind of dialing in the systems for fielding leads. A lot of newer attorneys to working lead generation may not realize that working leads is a different business model as far as the strategies we use. I mean that’s one of the reasons we’re doing this podcast is to kind of help people understand that working leads is a little bit different than people just referring clients to your office that represented their friends, families, neighbors.

By the time they’re referred to you, they’re 80% on the way in the door and pretty much ready to hire you. Whereas with lead generation, the clients don’t know who you are yet, they have some credibility from our brand, knowing who we are, but they haven’t met you before. The strategy as far as building more trust, building the relationship upfront, getting started working with them, getting them comfortable, getting them in the office, and taking time more on the front end to make sure they feel comfortable is a very different approach. Maybe this is a good kind of segue to kind of dive into more of the strategy that makes a difference, but it seems like you’ve kind of discovered the same too that it just takes time to really dial in those systems when it comes to fielding leads, hey?

Ardy Pirnia: Yeah. When you’re an attorney and you own your own firm and you’re the one who’s bringing the clients in, you’re a salesman. More than ever with the lead generation in the last few years and the saturation of lawyers, you’re not a commodity. You’ve got to sell yourself and you got to show the value that you’re going to bring to these clients. You really got to be a hustler in the sense that when you’re talking to the client, you can pick up on the things that are important to them. Then you start to play on those things in the conversation. You pick up whether they can afford $500 down or they can afford $2,000 down. You pick up on where do they live, what’s their life experiences. These things all matter in crafting the sale.

That’s why you can’t just expect to give them a call and say, “Hey, when are you coming to the office?” You got to take your time. How are you doing? How was your day? How are you feeling? I’m so sorry you’re going through this. Build a small relationship. Build some rapport for five minutes. Then when you get into the numbers or when you’re meeting them, I don’t give them a choice as much and that’s really the main part of my system. I almost say it’s like it’s a foregone conclusion after I build the rapport. I say, “So when’s good for you next week to come in? I have Tuesday open,” and they don’t even think twice. It’s got to be smooth. It can’t be mechanical. It can’t be assumed.

Dave Aarons: Why don’t we start from just kind of grunting through the process from when the leads come in? Maybe we could just start there. Do you call all the leads yourself? If so, what’s the notification tool you’re using? Are you getting the text messages and then you respond to the text from your phone or do you get the email and then respond accordingly? What’s that initial contact look like?

Ardy Pirnia: This is actually an interesting development since the last time I was on with you in the webinar. In the beginning, I did all the calls myself and my conversions were one to two, one to three steady. Then when I started hiring a staff, which Unbundled is really the reason for at this point, the expansion, I had my lead paralegal for immigration and lead paralegal for family law making the calls. I found that the closing rate dropping to one out of four, one out of five. What I realized is if your paralegals or your staff are the ones who are going to make that initial call, you have to make sure they’re invested in a sense that they really, really care and they’re not just making cold call and they’re like, “Hey, you know, do you want to sign up?

We heard you needed help,” and if they don’t, “Okay. Sorry. Thanks. Bye.” That’s not going to work and it’s not going to fly with these clients. They need to feel like they’re talking to the lawyer. I do every single call to every client. Once I get the lead, I call them. I just got one right now actually for immigration. I just call them within an hour.

Dave Aarons: While we’re on the podcast?

Ardy Pirnia: While we’re online. 3:57 PM and 4:23 PM. Anyway, I got to go pretty soon, but anyway, you make contact within the hour. I can’t tell you how many of them say … The first thing they say, “Oh my gosh. You called me so quickly. Oh my god. I can’t believe it’s a lawyer.” I mean they get so excited to know that you’re making that touch base. Now the other thing is a lot of times I don’t have time to make that 5, 10 minute sale, and I don’t like to do it rushed or when I’m doing something else, so sometimes I’ll even call them and say, “Just wanted to let you know we got your inquiry, and we’re going to be following up with you in the next few hours,” and they’ll wait for your call.

That’s the most important thing is to make that contact within an hour because I’ll tell you, I’ve lost dozens of Unbundled clients whether the leads come in on the weekend, and I’m out of town, or it’s a buddy’s birthday, and I was out of my town. My phone had died. My mailbox is full. If those things happen, I’ve lost many clients and many good cases. That initial touching base with the client is very important within the hour, and I always do it myself because this is my business. I’m the one paying for the lead. I’m the one that cares most about making the money, and I just frankly don’t trust anyone else to do as good of a job as I can in the sense of not only caring but in following the system.

Now diving deeper into the system, what I do is I make sure that they know that we’re giving them … The national average I tell them that we’re way below that. Not only that, it’s the California State average we’re way below that is what we’re charging them. I tell them also that we’re doing this to give back to the community, which is the truth. We enjoy helping people who have low income and don’t know where to turn. They really, really appreciate that. They connect with you. It’s at that point that I always give them two options. I say, “Would you prefer to meet in the office face-to-face or do you want to take care of everything electronically?” I found that this is about 70% who want to see you face-to-face, 30% don’t mind doing it electronically.

What do they do? I text them my Wells Fargo attorney-client trust account number. I tell them to go to any Wells Fargo in the country. You deposit your retainer. I’ll give you the account number, and the name of the firm and then we’ll correspondent through email and text. If we need to appear, we meet at the courthouse. If we don’t need to appear, we take care of everything that way. Otherwise, when they come in, we make sure to give them the same quality time we’d give a full price paying client. My conversion rate once they walk into the firm is 90%.

Dave Aarons: Wow. That’s really solid as far as the amount of folks that are coming in and are pulling the trigger. We can talk more about why that is as far as the types of options you offer because I know you do very, very creative types of approaches. What in your mind, you’ve been doing this for six months and take a very high volume of leads, what mistakes have you made in the past that maybe you’ve corrected or what is it that you feel is really the characteristics or the things that really lead to that level of conversion rate when they come in the office?

Ardy Pirnia: Well, you know Dave, what I’ve realized is when they come into the office, these are not the most sophisticated clients. These are not the wealthiest clients. These are clients that have probably never encountered a lawyer or been to a lawyer’s office. What I realized is when they come in, it’s a really special moment for them. It’s a big deal. I mean I can’t tell you how many of them are nervous in the beginning as if they’re on a first date. If you make them feel comfortable in your office and you … If it does feel like a big deal for them and you make them realize it is a big deal that they’re …

For me, I’m telling them, “Look, you’re in a Beverly Hills law firm and you’re going to get Beverly Hills law firm service and you’re going to have postage and things sent out on your behalf from a Beverly Hills address at a 60% to 80% reduction of what it normally would cost.” It’s a no-brainer for them. I know not every attorney in Unbundled is in Beverly Hills or whatever, but the point is as long as you have that presentation and you make them feel like they’re getting such good value for their money, there’s really no reason that they’re not going to sign up right then and there unless they actually literally just don’t have the money on them or don’t have money at all.

Dave Aarons: Right. We’ll kind of dive into the family law a little bit and then you’ve been taking the immigration leads for some time now. I definitely want to get to that before we run out of time. Real briefly, maybe you could touch on the types of unbundled options you offer and how you have been able to kind of adjust or adapt the types of options that you offer based upon the person’s legal needs and also their financial considerations and maybe talk briefly about what those rates are or what the types of options are and the payment plans or whatever you’ve put together or found to be most effective?

Ardy Pirnia: What I do is I don’t use retainers in the sense that I ask them to give me money and bill them hourly. When they come in, I do a quick intake. I get a feel for the case and what they need. I give them a ballpark, which I tell them is plus or minus $500. I do this for two reasons. One, as I said, these clients are not the most sophisticated in the sense that the concept of a retainer makes them very nervous. I mean even me, if I wasn’t a lawyer and I went to a lawyer, I’d be hesitant to say, “Hey, here’s five grand and send me the bill every month and hope you get my things done.” I just don’t like that system and I understand why people don’t trust it and like it. What I do is I say, “Hey.”

In family law for example, if someone wants to do a modification of a custody and what it takes is about an hour’s worth of filling out forms, an hour or two of making a declaration that’s tailored to that specific client, and then about half a day’s appearance at a courthouse. Now I can’t tell the attorneys in our group what is worth it to them, but for me, 1,500 bucks or more is definitely worth it for all that work. I mean I look at it as four, five hours of manpower making $1,500 or more. You’re making $300 an hour. You’re getting cash really from all these clients. For me, that’s worth it. What I tell them is, “Look, this is something that would cost normally $3,000 to $5,000. What I can do is try to keep it at $1,500 to $2,000.

Give or take a couple hundred bucks and not including costs.” The other thing that I do is I tell them, “You don’t need to pay it up all upfront.” This is really where the analysis of a person to person comes in. I get a feel for what I think they can afford and I go as low as I need to. I’ve only maybe a handful of times gone under 500 bucks, but I like to get $1,000 down, but I’ll go between $500 to $1,000 just to get them in the door. Once they’re invested, once they’ve put their money where their mouth is, they’re going to be your clients and they’re going to see it through with you as long as you know what you’re doing and you’re doing a good job. That’s kind of the system. We get them in the door. We show them a good presentation.

They put down $500 to $1,000. We do a good job for them. At the date of the hearing, they come with the rest of the money and it’s just been really fluid in that way.

Dave Aarons: Okay. Great. This is kind of a theme of all the episodes we’ve done, and the lawyers have seemed to be doing the best is that a lot of attorneys that aren’t familiar with unbundled legal services might go, “Wow. $500, that’s nothing. How you could you do anything for that person for that kind of money?” That’s again how this differs not only in what we’re trying to do as far as helping people and giving them something they can afford and move forward with, but also that it’s a lead and it’s an opportunity to get the person started at a rate that’s low touch. That’s something that’s not too much of a hurdle to come up with and something that’s a target they can see and hit right off the bat.

That gives them an opportunity to not only meet you and get to know you but also once they start working with you, then they kind of pay as you go. Then a lot of clients then they transition to full representation. You get more people that are building up the funnel of the amount of clients that are working with you, that are going to refer your business. It’s really what you can get them started working with because then once they’ve invested, then they’re really going to stick it out from there.

Ardy Pirnia: Yeah. Dave, this is maybe my biggest thing that I’m most adamant about and I talk to lawyers about it all the time, I mean I’ve talked to probably half a dozen Unbundled Attorneys who’ll call me personally and I definitely … I encourage you to give my number to anyone that wants to talk to me one-on-one for any advice as well, which I’ve done for about half a dozens of these attorneys. Every single one talk to me about this, I don’t know who we think we are when we say that $500 is not a lot of money. If you’re using Unbundled Attorney to build up your practice, we have no right to think of ourselves in that high as a manner.

What I think to myself is if someone’s giving me $500 and planning to give me another $1,000 to $2,000 to $3,000 for work that takes a few hours and for a lead that cost me $45, there is no bigger value I’ve seen in four years in the legal field than what we do here at Unbundled. I mean I’m paying $45 for a family law lead, which in the month of February made me $2,000. That’s 50 times my money almost. It doesn’t exist. Then when you start compounding it and in the month of February I had four clients, that’s eight grand when I spent two. Then when you start adding in the side cases that they refer you, I mean it’s just endless the opportunities, the possibilities. That concept of, “Oh, $500 is not enough, $1,000 is not enough,” it’s just thinking too short of time.

It’s just thinking too month to month. That’s not what we’re doing here. If you went to law school, well, part of you wants to make a lot of money and be very successful. If in the beginning you’re already just trying to expect $10,000 retainer clients to walk in the door, you’re not going to go anywhere.

Dave Aarons: Right. We definitely had a big shift in the marketplace where we went from maybe a third of clients representing themselves 10 years ago to two-thirds representing themselves. It’s pretty clear especially since 2008 that the big $10,000 clients they’re an anomaly if anything and is swallowed up by a lot of large firms. The adaptation is necessary. This is really what this is all about is empowering attorneys such as yourself and everyone else to start rethinking the ways in which they can start offering these options so that they can fit people’s budget, they can pay as they go, they can do unbundled options, they can do some of the work on their own.

The folks and get through the process in a way that’s going to make it so they don’t make mistakes and can actually succeed and have a competent attorney walking them through it.

Ardy Pirnia: Sure.

Dave Aarons: Maybe you could just talk about the differences between the immigration leads versus the family law lead. I know you’ve had to kind of adapt some different strategies to work with them because there are different kinds of cases. It’s maybe a slightly different kind of person, but also just the time factors aren’t the same. You don’t have the same level of urgency and so the approach has to be a little different. Maybe you could just kind of talk maybe generally first how you’ve kind of adapted and how they’re different.

Ardy Pirnia: I find the immigration to be a bit of a tougher sell than family law. There are different factors that go into it. It has nothing to do with the quality of the leads. The quality of the lead is just as good as family. These are clients are 90% foreign and there’s a huge language barrier. It’s sometimes difficult to even understand what they’re saying. They don’t understand what we’re saying. Two, they’re desperate even more so than family law. In family law, I mean people are desperate when it comes to losing their spouse or their child. When you’re about to get thrown out of a country or there’s risk of deportation or your loved one is about to get sent away, or they need to be able to work, I mean these people are very desperate.

What I found is that also makes them that much more skeptical and nervous. You really, really have to be patient with them. You’ve got to have a lot of follow-ups. A lot of them are calling you from foreign countries, so the timing is off. I mean I have this one client who we couldn’t contact for a week and then finally he emailed and said, “Listen, I’m in Beirut. I have an eight-hour difference, nine-hour difference. You need to call me at this time.” It just takes a lot more maintenance, but on the flip side, the value is there as well because, in family law, there’s a lot more work to put in. There are no hearings in immigration law for the most part. I mean to this point, I haven’t done one hearing and haven’t needed to.

Otherwise, it’s all transactional. If you have a great paralegal or law clerk that you can train to dot I’s, cross the T’s, check the boxes, you can really make almost 10 to 15 times your money on the lead. Now our first four clients, I have the list here actually, this is out of 40 leads. We signed up at $3,500, $1,800, $2,750 and $1,900. As you can see, we spent about $3,000 for the lead generation and we made back almost 10. The other thing is three of these were adjustment of status, which is just filling out almost 20 pages of document and just thoroughly going through them and then mailing it in and waiting for it to come through. These clients paid in full upfront. It took maybe hour, two hours each one. It’s harder to walk them in.

It’s harder to get them signed up. Sometimes they’re far. You have to do everything electronically. They’re nervous about that, but the value is definitely there if you put in the work in terms of the hour to money ratio.

Dave Aarons: Has there been some strategies or anything specific that you’ve learned in fielding the immigration leads as you kind of adapted over the last few months or however long it’s been that is different than family law that’s very specific to this as far as either how you approach the call, the follow-up systems you’ve had to develop, or any systems within your business to make that more of a conducive process?

Ardy Pirnia: Yeah. Well, number one, if the retainer wasn’t a good concept for family law, just completely throw it out the window for immigration. It’s not going to happen. These people are so skeptical that you’re even a real person. They’re not just going to give you money and hopes this works out. They want a guarantee. They want to know that you know what you’re doing and that they have a good chance at least of becoming a citizen. Now obviously we can’t guarantee it for anyone and we don’t, but you’ve really got to make them feel comfortable that for this amount of money they can do what needs to be done. That’s number one.

I really encourage anyone using immigration leads do not use the retainer method. It’s not going to work with these people. Number two …

Dave Aarons: Can you clarify that? Well, coming to number two, I don’t want to get too far off track, but retainer method meaning that you start with something small or something specific?

Ardy Pirnia: Yeah. This entire call, when I refer to a retainer, I mean someone putting down a certain amount of money and expecting you to bill them hourly. That system does not work for me. I don’t use it at all. This entire conversation when I’m talking about family law and I gave that system that I used, that’s what I meant. For immigration, I mean it even more. If you expect someone in these immigration leads to giving you three grand and you’re going to bill them, it’s not going to happen. They want to know how much does it cost for me to adjust my status? How much does it cost for me to get a work visa? How much does it cost for me to get a green card? You got to really know your numbers and know what it cost you. The way I do it is I have a fantastic paralegal.

I mean the guy is a God-send. He’s one of the best I’ve ever seen. He has a menu almost. He says, “Work visa, $750. Green card, $1,250. Adjustment of status, $650.” This is what it’ll cost him to do all the paperwork for me. All I need to know is how much do I want to make on top of what I’m paying the paralegal and that’s the way that I can do this none retainer method and really monetize. We had one client who I paid him $750 to do all the paperwork and I charge them $2,750. Right there you’re making two grand and you’re really just making a sale over the call. That’s the beauty of where we are in terms of technology I think and the 21st century. We can be middlemen because of Unbundled, the leads are so good.

The hard part is being the salesman. It’s converting them. Finding a way to monetize on them is easy. All you need is to have someone be able to do the work or if you want to do it yourself, do it yourself, but I recommend for the attorneys in the system to start finding a paralegal. It’s paramount to being successful. Because if they can do the paperwork, you have the time to follow-up. You have the time to make the calls. That was going to be my second point, which is a lot of people they’re worried to take on that extra expense. In the beginning, it was, “Oh my god. I’m going to spend money on leads and marketing. That’s a heavy expense.” It takes a while for someone to bite the bullet and put down another $2,000 or $3,000 a month for a paralegal.

I tell you, ever since I did that, it took my business to another level because I had more time to get more clients. I had time to talk to you and Graham about the immigration leads and how is it working, how is it not working. This is what the business owner is supposed to do. We’re not supposed to be there filling out an FL-310.

Dave Aarons: Right, or at least you shouldn’t be taking up the majority of your time. Especially with lead generation programs, that’s where you’re focusing your time is making those contacts really shortly after that lead comes in, being available to do that, being available to have a conversation, being available to share the vision of what it is that you do, how you’re different. It is a CEO role. You are the vision and the idea behind and conveying who you are, what you’re doing. Right. How do you build that trust when you have someone that’s so skeptical?

Ardy Pirnia: It’s interesting actually now that you asked, with immigration clients, you, unfortunately, need to play to their despotism a little bit because you tell them that, “Look.” You give them the same presentation and the same nurturing feeling and all that, but at the end, I almost act as if I really don’t care what they do. I tell them, “Look, this is what we can offer you. This is how much it’s going to cost, and it’s up to you. If you want to get started, we need $1,000 down. If you don’t, I wish you good luck, but I can tell you that I guarantee you won’t find a better price than what we’re offering you.” It’s the truth. When you’re that straightforward with them especially foreign people, they’re more straightforward and to the point.

They don’t like games. They don’t need that nice guy. They want to know it’s going to get done. They appreciate it and then they usually jump on it.

Dave Aarons: Awesome. Well, listen Ardy, I really want to thank you for taking the time to jump on the show and kind of share how things have been going for you. We’re certainly going to keep doing what we do. Keep bringing as many of the folks we can, but I really appreciate all the hard work you guys are doing in LA and the surrounding areas for these clients. We’re getting some great feedback. I just want to tell you that I appreciate everything you’re doing for the folks we’re sending you.

Ardy Pirnia: Thank you. I appreciate you guys. You’ve taken my practice to another level and I want more. We want more practice areas, Dave.

Dave Aarons: Okay, Ardy. Have a good rest of your day. For everyone else that’s listening to the show, thanks for listening in. We’ll see you on the next episode.

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Episode 10: From Brand New Practice to Tens of Thousands in Monthly Revenue in Six Months\r \r In this episode we interview provider attorney, Ardy Pirnia. Fueled by a high volume of Unbundled leads, Ardy has grown his solo practitioner law firm into a successful practice with 3 paralegals, 3 employees and tens of thousands in monthly revenue in six months. Ardy shares how he achieved his success through the use of internet leads, and explains the core strategies that have laid the foundation for the extraordinarily rapid growth of his firm. \r \r You’ll Learn:\r \r

  • How Ardy converts 1 out of every 4 of his leads into paying clients\r
  • Why he uses a strategy that involves speaking to every lead himself\r
  • How low barrier starting fees of $500-$1000 has contributed to his success \r
  • Ardy’s insights into the long term value of quality internet leads that many attorneys overlook \r
  • How to capture and master the art of selling yourself and your firm’s unique value to prospective clients \r
  • Why Ardy chose flat rate billing instead of traditional retainers with billable hours \r
  • Important strategic distinctions in managing family law or immigration leads\r
  • How to leverage the support of your paralegals to increase margins and bolster sales from immigration leads\r
  • And much more\r \r If you are enjoying this podcast, be sure to subscribe and receive each new episode as it is published. \r \r For more information about Unbundled Attorney and how our Lead Generation services help grow your practice, visit:

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